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	<title>Comments on: KinkForAll New York City: Rest and Recovery and Then We Do It All Over Again</title>
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	<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/</link>
	<description>Because &#039;kinky&#039; is an adjective, not an activity</description>
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		<title>By: maymay</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9340</link>
		<dc:creator>maymay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 21:15:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9340</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-9279&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;subversive sub&lt;/a&gt;, I think collaboration between a group like (what you describe) Anarkink (as being) and something like KinkForAll isn&#039;t just logical, it&#039;s &lt;em&gt;perfect&lt;/em&gt;. Please do ask around your group and also please join and encourage others to join the &lt;a href=&quot;http://groups.google.com/group/kinkforall&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;KinkForAll mailing list&lt;/a&gt;, where most (un)organizational efforts happen.

Also, let me point out that the more people contribute individually and with their own initiative, the less each of us has to do centrally to make things happen. Although this is counter-intuitive to many people who believe oversight is essential, I believe the abundance of resources that KFANYC managed to procure in &lt;em&gt;literally&lt;/em&gt; about 3 months time with &lt;em&gt;no prior blueprint in these communities&lt;/em&gt; proves those people incorrect.

Many (although not all) times, oversight in groups like these are really just another way of expressing distrust or ego-centricity, and that&#039;s just pointless.

&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-9282&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Sigrid&lt;/a&gt;, I can&#039;t say thank you to you &lt;em&gt;personally&lt;/em&gt; enough times, so I&#039;ll just keep saying it: thank you for the amazing and exemplary support you gave the idea, especially from so far away. You are the perfect figurehead for the good people I&#039;m betting on to step up with their own initiative and resources and make the global vision of all the great, positive things KinkForAll can be a reality. From the bottom of my heart, I thank you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-9279" rel="nofollow">subversive sub</a>, I think collaboration between a group like (what you describe) Anarkink (as being) and something like KinkForAll isn&#8217;t just logical, it&#8217;s <em>perfect</em>. Please do ask around your group and also please join and encourage others to join the <a href="http://groups.google.com/group/kinkforall" rel="nofollow">KinkForAll mailing list</a>, where most (un)organizational efforts happen.</p>
<p>Also, let me point out that the more people contribute individually and with their own initiative, the less each of us has to do centrally to make things happen. Although this is counter-intuitive to many people who believe oversight is essential, I believe the abundance of resources that KFANYC managed to procure in <em>literally</em> about 3 months time with <em>no prior blueprint in these communities</em> proves those people incorrect.</p>
<p>Many (although not all) times, oversight in groups like these are really just another way of expressing distrust or ego-centricity, and that&#8217;s just pointless.</p>
<p><a href="#comment-9282" rel="nofollow">Sigrid</a>, I can&#8217;t say thank you to you <em>personally</em> enough times, so I&#8217;ll just keep saying it: thank you for the amazing and exemplary support you gave the idea, especially from so far away. You are the perfect figurehead for the good people I&#8217;m betting on to step up with their own initiative and resources and make the global vision of all the great, positive things KinkForAll can be a reality. From the bottom of my heart, I thank you.</p>
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		<title>By: Sigrid</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9282</link>
		<dc:creator>Sigrid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 00:12:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9282</guid>
		<description>So glad I finally got a chance to see your presentation; thanks to Audacia Ray for vidding it!  I&#039;m fascinated about the prospects NYC opens up, and am anxiously looking forward to seeing how the next few chips fall.  Thank you for all your hard work, especially long distance and in such otherwise trying times.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So glad I finally got a chance to see your presentation; thanks to Audacia Ray for vidding it!  I&#8217;m fascinated about the prospects NYC opens up, and am anxiously looking forward to seeing how the next few chips fall.  Thank you for all your hard work, especially long distance and in such otherwise trying times.</p>
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		<title>By: subversive_sub</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9279</link>
		<dc:creator>subversive_sub</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 23:58:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9279</guid>
		<description>Man, I really wish I could have been there; sounds truly awesome. I sort of want to help contribute to a San Francisco KFA, but feel almost over my head with the stuff I’m already working on with Anarkink, this anarchist BDSM group we’re starting to get off the ground. (In full-stress mode now trying to plan for our presence at and party after the SF Anarchist Bookfair…) 

That said, I’ll bet there are other folks in Anarkink who would be really interested in helping with such a thing; I’ll ask and see if there’s anyone who wants to get involved.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Man, I really wish I could have been there; sounds truly awesome. I sort of want to help contribute to a San Francisco KFA, but feel almost over my head with the stuff I’m already working on with Anarkink, this anarchist BDSM group we’re starting to get off the ground. (In full-stress mode now trying to plan for our presence at and party after the SF Anarchist Bookfair…) </p>
<p>That said, I’ll bet there are other folks in Anarkink who would be really interested in helping with such a thing; I’ll ask and see if there’s anyone who wants to get involved.</p>
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		<title>By: maymay</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9273</link>
		<dc:creator>maymay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:29:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9273</guid>
		<description>Oh yeah, also, as a quick followup, &lt;a href=&quot;#comment-9271&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Clarisse&lt;/a&gt;, let me add that KinkForAll is &lt;em&gt;not&lt;/em&gt; my first attempt at engaging the traditional sexuality communities in the way you saw at the unconference. I&#039;ve been trying to do stuff like this for a &lt;em&gt;long&lt;/em&gt; time, as have many, many other people (as I discovered when they started to contact me recently as they learned about KinkForAll). However, it&#039;s thanks to the success of &lt;em&gt;this effort&lt;/em&gt; that my work on this front is beginning to show significant results of the form that I hoped. Live and learn, I suppose. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh yeah, also, as a quick followup, <a href="#comment-9271" rel="nofollow">Clarisse</a>, let me add that KinkForAll is <em>not</em> my first attempt at engaging the traditional sexuality communities in the way you saw at the unconference. I&#8217;ve been trying to do stuff like this for a <em>long</em> time, as have many, many other people (as I discovered when they started to contact me recently as they learned about KinkForAll). However, it&#8217;s thanks to the success of <em>this effort</em> that my work on this front is beginning to show significant results of the form that I hoped. Live and learn, I suppose. :)</p>
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		<title>By: maymay</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9272</link>
		<dc:creator>maymay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:26:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9272</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-9271&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Clarisse&lt;/a&gt;, the short answer (because I haven&#039;t much time at the moment), is that yes, I did what I knew I could but that doesn&#039;t mean I couldn&#039;t do more next time. I &lt;em&gt;completely&lt;/em&gt; agree with you with regards to trying to involve the current community, and I think the awesome participation of people like Boymeat and Lolita and Dov, who each have strong ties to much more &quot;traditional, old guard&quot; communities than I do, shows that their participation is not only valuable, but very critical.

I&#039;m hugely in favor of bringing other organizations involved with spreading KinkForAlls, but I&#039;m also &lt;em&gt;insistent&lt;/em&gt; that their participation come not from organizational resources, but from individual resources. In other words, what I loved about Boymeat and Lolita and Dov&#039;s participation, to name just the obvious examples of many more similar stories, is that it was them, &lt;em&gt;as people&lt;/em&gt;, who participated. It was not them as representatives of some larger organization.

Again, this is not about institutional support, but rather individual collaboration. For more on this great topic and the mathematics behind why it works today, I urge you to &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/clay_shirky_on_institutions_versus_collaboration.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;watch Clay Shirky&#039;s amazing 20-minute TEDTalk video, Institution vs. Collaboration&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-9271" rel="nofollow">Clarisse</a>, the short answer (because I haven&#8217;t much time at the moment), is that yes, I did what I knew I could but that doesn&#8217;t mean I couldn&#8217;t do more next time. I <em>completely</em> agree with you with regards to trying to involve the current community, and I think the awesome participation of people like Boymeat and Lolita and Dov, who each have strong ties to much more &#8220;traditional, old guard&#8221; communities than I do, shows that their participation is not only valuable, but very critical.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m hugely in favor of bringing other organizations involved with spreading KinkForAlls, but I&#8217;m also <em>insistent</em> that their participation come not from organizational resources, but from individual resources. In other words, what I loved about Boymeat and Lolita and Dov&#8217;s participation, to name just the obvious examples of many more similar stories, is that it was them, <em>as people</em>, who participated. It was not them as representatives of some larger organization.</p>
<p>Again, this is not about institutional support, but rather individual collaboration. For more on this great topic and the mathematics behind why it works today, I urge you to <a href="http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/clay_shirky_on_institutions_versus_collaboration.html" rel="nofollow">watch Clay Shirky&#8217;s amazing 20-minute TEDTalk video, Institution vs. Collaboration</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Clarisse</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9271</link>
		<dc:creator>Clarisse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:56:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9271</guid>
		<description>I think the problem with established kink organizations probably has to do more with how much older their leadership is.  They don&#039;t have the same technical expertise that we have gained simply by growing up in the Internet age.  They don&#039;t see the opportunities the same way we do.  There&#039;s never been anything like our current technical models before ....  The quasi-anarchist model of the conference itself is also, in many ways, new.  It&#039;s hard for people who have an awful lot of experience in things that work to immediately jump on the bandwagon for new and untested things.

The point I&#039;m trying to make is that (a) scene organizations will therefore change as a new generation starts having a greater impact on their memberships, and (b) a lot of the time, we can jumpstart that by making an serious effort to join the organizations or at least involve them.  The KFANYC group was mostly younger.  I wonder if this isn&#039;t so much because older non-internet people were uninterested, as that they simply didn&#039;t know about it -- or think it was for them -- because it wasn&#039;t promoted through the channels they&#039;re used to.  Maybe other KFAs could make an effort to promote with fliers, cards, at in-person meetings, etc.

All this having been said, I have no real idea what the scene is like in New York.  So forgive me if you really did do your best to get established organizations involved and they ignored you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the problem with established kink organizations probably has to do more with how much older their leadership is.  They don&#8217;t have the same technical expertise that we have gained simply by growing up in the Internet age.  They don&#8217;t see the opportunities the same way we do.  There&#8217;s never been anything like our current technical models before &#8230;.  The quasi-anarchist model of the conference itself is also, in many ways, new.  It&#8217;s hard for people who have an awful lot of experience in things that work to immediately jump on the bandwagon for new and untested things.</p>
<p>The point I&#8217;m trying to make is that (a) scene organizations will therefore change as a new generation starts having a greater impact on their memberships, and (b) a lot of the time, we can jumpstart that by making an serious effort to join the organizations or at least involve them.  The KFANYC group was mostly younger.  I wonder if this isn&#8217;t so much because older non-internet people were uninterested, as that they simply didn&#8217;t know about it &#8212; or think it was for them &#8212; because it wasn&#8217;t promoted through the channels they&#8217;re used to.  Maybe other KFAs could make an effort to promote with fliers, cards, at in-person meetings, etc.</p>
<p>All this having been said, I have no real idea what the scene is like in New York.  So forgive me if you really did do your best to get established organizations involved and they ignored you.</p>
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		<title>By: ranat</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9270</link>
		<dc:creator>ranat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:40:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9270</guid>
		<description>Hi!!! It was really awesome to finally meet you in the flesh! KFA was an incredible experience (and has inspired me to get my ass into gear for the HTporn I have that&#039;s mostly written but not quite finished). Here&#039;s to many more internet conversations (the internet is good for something :P). Good luck tying up loose work ends!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi!!! It was really awesome to finally meet you in the flesh! KFA was an incredible experience (and has inspired me to get my ass into gear for the HTporn I have that&#8217;s mostly written but not quite finished). Here&#8217;s to many more internet conversations (the internet is good for something :P). Good luck tying up loose work ends!</p>
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		<title>By: maymay</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9269</link>
		<dc:creator>maymay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:30:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9269</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-9266&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Maja&lt;/a&gt;, individual Flickr images can have their own privacy settings within the group. (Individual contributors who upload their own photos to Flickr and add them to the group can set different levels of who can see what for each picture.) Many of the images probably require you to be logged in to Flickr to see them. So, first, try that. If you still can&#039;t see them, join the KinkForAll Flickr group itself. If that &lt;em&gt;still&lt;/em&gt; doesn&#039;t work, let me know so I can ping the people who uploaded the pictures and let them know that their pictures are not public, just in case they didn&#039;t set strict privacy settings on their photos on purpose. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-9266" rel="nofollow">Maja</a>, individual Flickr images can have their own privacy settings within the group. (Individual contributors who upload their own photos to Flickr and add them to the group can set different levels of who can see what for each picture.) Many of the images probably require you to be logged in to Flickr to see them. So, first, try that. If you still can&#8217;t see them, join the KinkForAll Flickr group itself. If that <em>still</em> doesn&#8217;t work, let me know so I can ping the people who uploaded the pictures and let them know that their pictures are not public, just in case they didn&#8217;t set strict privacy settings on their photos on purpose. :)</p>
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		<title>By: Maja</title>
		<link>http://maybemaimed.com/2009/03/10/kinkforall-new-york-city-rest-and-recovery-and-then-we-do-it-all-over-again/#comment-9266</link>
		<dc:creator>Maja</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 16:33:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://maybemaimed.com/?p=729#comment-9266</guid>
		<description>Hey! Quick thing - the flickr link isn&#039;t working for me - I can only see the flame icon. Am I a doofus and am missing where to find the other photos, or has something malfunctioned?

I want to put all of my KFA records online too - it&#039;s my goal for my next chunk of free time!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey! Quick thing &#8211; the flickr link isn&#8217;t working for me &#8211; I can only see the flame icon. Am I a doofus and am missing where to find the other photos, or has something malfunctioned?</p>
<p>I want to put all of my KFA records online too &#8211; it&#8217;s my goal for my next chunk of free time!</p>
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