(Posting anew so this will show up in #rolequeer tagspace.)

theungrumpablegrinch:

Maymay is annoyed with recent rolequeer discussion of domination, so I have a few words to add on the topic.

Let’s say I have a friend and occasional lover; we’ll call him the Scotsman for reasons that may become apparent. One night I ask the Scotsman to fuck my mouth and call me his little slut, because I think that sounds super hot. We have sex in the manner I requested, I spend the night, and in the morning he makes me breakfast. Both of us are happy and feel well-treated.

If we have sex in similar fashion many times, so that it becomes the pattern of our relationship, I’d certainly characterize the Scotsman as dominant. By application of Maymay’s Syllogism, the Scotsman is thus also a rapist, and there is absolutely nothing I can say or feel to change this.

Discussion questions:

  1. “Can ‘dominants are rapists’ admit exceptions, in principle if not in practice?
  2. If you and I have a good-faith disagreement about whether I was raped, which of us can ultimately speak more authoritatively to that question?
  3. X’s are usually Y’s. Does it follow that all X’s are Y’s? Phrase your answer in the form of a consistent set of mathematical axioms.

Look, I know you’re just baiting me, because your blog makes it pretty clear that you’re actually one of Ozy’s shitstain scumbag friends, little more than a smug self-righteous dipshit who has no intention of engaging with any rolequeer ideas in even a remotely respectful way, but you’ve also got the brainpower equivalent of a cockroach when it comes to this stuff, and are unable to compose anything other than strawman arguments. To that end, observe.

The two obvious problems with your premise:

  • You are not capable of defining other people’s identities. If the Scotsman does not identify as dominant, you can not determine from your own experiences whether he is “a Dominant (person)” or not. You can only observe his actions and make a judgement about each of his acts regarding whether you believe they are acts of domination or not. Obviously.
  • If you do not feel raped, you were not raped. This is true regardless of what acts took place, because the defining element of rape is not an utterance but the felt sense of a sexual violation. That is, rape is the experience of sexual violation, not the lack of a “no” nor the presence of a “yes.” If you “feel well-treated” and you do not “feel raped” then you were not raped. Obviously.

That is to say, firstly, you are intentionally conflating identities with actions. We’ve been over this, but you don’t care, because you’re a shitstain. Secondly, you’re treating consent violations as a set of specific things one person can do to another, rather than an experience people can have about any given act with any number of people, including only themselves. We went over this many, many times, too, but you don’t care, because you’re a shitstain.

Now, the answers to the questions:

  1. No. There isn’t a need to “admit exceptions” because there are no exceptions. The logic holds; a Dominant (person) is not the same thing as a dominant act. People are not reducible to the acts they take. Doing that to people is called dehumanization, and it’s a shitty thing to do. Obviously.
  2. You. We are each the authority on our own lived experiences, because only I know whether I felt consenting, and only you know whether you felt consenting. Obviously.
  3. No. See also correlation is not causation. Obviously.

I already know you think you just checkmated the whole idea of rolequeerness and consent as a felt sense, “but, maymay, how can Dominants be rapists if, y’know, #NotAllDoms,” and I’ll just point you back to your first mistaken premise. But you won’t care, because you’re a shitstain.

You either know exactly what I am saying yet still can’t refrain from adding your unneeded two cents worth anyway, or you are so hopelessly stunted by your own emotional cowardice that you don’t actually want to have an honest look at yourself in the context of the world you live in. Because you’re a shitstain. And that’s fine, I’m not trying to convince you of anything; this isn’t even about you.

So why don’t we just cut to the chase, here, Mr. Grinch? Let me tell you what’s going to happen.

I’m going to ask you again to stop talking about or to me or to my friends, to go the fuck away, and get the fuck out of #rolequeer spaces. You are not welcome here, you are not useful here, you are by all my measures less valuable alive than you are dead. But you will not actually go away nor will you change your behavior or begin engaging respectfully or honestly with me or this work. You will instead continue to play games with euphemism and concealment, disingenuously making trite arguments with your smug, self-righteous attitude as you have always done rather than argue any of your points honestly, because you’re a shitstain. You just don’t want things to change.

Meanwhile, I will ignore you as best I can, trudging through all the shit you and your shitstain mob of bullies project everywhere you can, engaging directly only when you provoke people I care about into responding to you, and only long enough to demonstrate your worthlessness. I will continue to make compelling points and ask difficult questions that make many people including you uncomfortable, and you and your friends will continue weakly rebutting them with transparent strawmen and trite projections of your own bigotries stemming from a corrosive superiority complex (a little thing called “privilege”) that you have. Because you’re a shitstain, and shitstains like you don’t want to critically analyze, or change, or even have a conversation about those bigotries. You just want to flag the bare minimum level of polite self-awareness to avoid being punished or judged.

Over time, as has been the case for years now, more and more people will find what I am saying and doing persuasive and useful to integrate into their own lives and for their own purposes. Some of them will challenge me, and I will argue with them, but we will be having an actual conversation, a conversation that will not involve you. After you and I are both long gone, Mr. Ungrumpable Grinch, your contributions will amount to little else than failed attempts to retain the abusive parts of a status quo that no longer exists, and mine will have meaningfully informed a more compassionate reality.

So. I’ll knock over the first domino: Go away, Mr. Grinch. Stop talking about or to me. And stop provoking my friends with derails.

Now, I want to address other rolequeers and folks who are engaging with these ideas honestly: if you see people like Mr. Grinch here, or his ilk, talking about this work, probably best ignore them. If you see people like Mr. Grinch talking to or about me, personally, and you feel like you have the wherewithal to tell them how unwelcome and abusive they are being continually picking fights with me for so many years without end, please do so. (Here’s an effective example of how to do that.) I do very much appreciate this kind of humanizing, personal, and public support.

But, at the same time, please be aware that disingenuous scumbag shitstains like Mr. Grinch will ultimately use your response as a thinly-veiled attempt to drag you and your energy—and thus indirectly me and mine—into another repetitive, circular, draining conversation in which nothing of value is produced. Because that’s their intention; that is exactly what men and Dominants and rapists (and this Mr. The Ungrumpable Grinch) want.

If you have any questions or concerns or any trouble identifying who might be disingenous and who might not be, please feel free to bring your concerns to me privately. I generally have a very broad view of who people are, who they are socially connected to, what they have said in the past, and what their motives tend to be, because I generally collect and maintain quite a bit of information about people who choose to make themselves my work’s explicit adversaries.

Edited to add: Oh, and in case you had any doubts about any of the above, you no longer need to trust my take it. Take Mr. Grinch’s, who just broadcasted his intents to be exactly what I described. Shitstains: still predictable.